Making Bold Moves, with Brenda Hodo-Iddris

TRANSCRIPT

Wassia Kamon: Welcome back to the diary of a CFO podcast, the space where you will find real world insight to become a better leader and be better at life. I'm your host, Wassia Kamon, and today I'm so delighted to have with me a very special guest. Her name is Brenda Hodo-Iddris. She is a CFO with over 20 years in finance and accounting and operations.

She has worked in public trading for for profit organization and also not profit. From large to small organizations, we spend several industries. She decided to focus on craft versus industry so that she always has a transferable skill set and knowledge that she can share regarding financial strategy and financial operations.

So she's able at the end of the day to apply that knowledge in any organization within any industry. Welcome to the Diary of the CFO. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Your profile, your background is so impressive. Would you please share a bit of a highlight?

What was your journey like to where you are now as a CFO?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: Sure. Simply put. undergrad and graduate school, I never had my sights on being a CFO. And for me, it was because I started out in my career working for really large publicly traded companies, you know, the 100, 000 employee companies. B of A, and then I went to work for a powerhouse publicly traded real estate developer, and I was in financial technology company, very large companies, and when you're in such a large company, having your sights on being the CFO of that company, it seems so out of reach.

Wow. And it was just not a focus of mine. And I was really focused on. Um, being the best, um, financial business partner within whatever region or division I was in.

And it wasn't until I was recruited, I was working for a smaller publicly traded bank in the city I lived in. I was recruited away, I was approached by a recruiter for an opportunity to join a nonprofit.

They wanted someone who had a for profit business background to help them. develop operation, financial operations and their F. P. N. A. And I never thought I would go into non profit either. Uh, but it was a great opportunity. And the CFO that recruited me, she was a former 30, 40 year veteran in the business.

And she really wanted my help. And so I jumped ship and said, okay, let me try this opportunity for, you know, a couple of years, help them out. I ended up being a non profit for 10 years.

And in that journey, she was a mentor of mine and when I speak about the CFO track, she told me one day that I had everything it took to be a CFO.

I had never thought about it. I honestly had

Wassia Kamon: never thought about it. And I went from there. Nice. Wow. Love that story because I also got pushed into nonprofit. So I was in manufacturing for 15 years. before joining a not for profit. And I understand how you say when you work for such a big organization it's hard to see yourself as a CFO.

It feels out of reach, but then when you switch from business size to industry, it's probably easier to get there. So besides that first switch to now you're in a not for profit, what has been that switch for you to get to that CFO stage?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: So I think that support and that inkling that she gave me and that mentorship, like, oh, I do because I hadn't focused on it.

I guess I had not really studied what it would take for someone to be a CFO at that level. I had really admired her so much because she was so Brilliant and so she's very smart and again, she started mentoring me. So when she told me that and she told it to me, it was like, we get over a cup of coffee.

Like it was, you didn't know this, that you could be a CFO of anywhere that you wanted to be a CFO of. And so, you know, I just started really paying attention to that and joining a lot, a lot of leadership groups. I had already been in leadership before then. And then so I just started having my sights set on that.

I'm very aggressive when it comes to my career. And so that, I guess, gave me an extra boost of confidence. And I began to focus on that path and put myself in positions and companies

Wassia Kamon: that had that CFO track. And can you please share a bit more about what you found out about when you say companies and roles, what kind of experiences did you feel you miss or wanted to do more of to get you further ahead?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: So for me, since I was already in nonprofit at the time, the way in I thought was to continue that path because now a lot of nonprofits are broken in terms of financial strategy and operations. I carved out myself a little niche in that space where I became the Olivia Pope, if you will, of finance and became the fixer, working to Repair a lot of their operations and help with implementing the right financial structure, negotiating debt deals and, and things like that to help nonprofits to survive.

So that is kind of how I built that path and start focusing on CFO leadership was through nonprofit because I felt it was an easier in to get that experience. knowing that it's really transferable to for profit as well. That's what I did. So I got that experience. I worked in non profit for 10 years and then my goal was to always go back to for profit and I had that opportunity three years ago and so I did that.

Wassia Kamon: Awesome.

So where you are now in that path to becoming the CFO you are today, there's a lot of things I have to do besides operation with strategy overall. And I realized that strategy is not something that, you know, you're taught typically in school. So how did you get to sharpen the strategic skills of being a finance leader?

Lesson

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: number one, you cannot be a strategic influencer and stay behind your desk. If I don't leave you with anything, I want to leave you with this. You have to be in the meetings. You have to be in the conversations. With your colleagues, your business partners, because if you're not, you're going to miss the information that's needed to help guide them and marry with the financial strategic solutions for the company.

That's 1. The 2nd thing that I really strongly believe helps is to extend yourself beyond the financials. You don't have to be limited to staying in your place. Financial or CFOs also have great business minds and solutions as well for the organization. You're just leading the financial operations. But you have so much more to offer in terms of knowing where the organization needs to go.

I think we have even more to offer than some of our colleagues because we have the edge up with the financial background. The trick is when you are in a role, people may see you one way. That's why you have to open your mouth, and you have to be seen and heard, and you can't do that unless you're in the discussions.

Yes. Oh, I love it. Now, I will say, is that easy to be seen and heard? No, sometimes they want to block you and not want you to attend the meetings or discussions. I don't want to hear what you have your input, but you have to really get them to understand. When I say them, it's your colleagues, your business partners.

Invite them to see and understand your view.

Wassia Kamon: I love what you said about you have to be in a conversation, you have to go beyond the financials, you have to be seen, you have to be, to be heard, even though sometimes, you know, may be hard to do it. In all that, you were able to niche yourself as the fixer. I want to just get back to it for a second.

Because if I see you as the Olivia Pope, right, as the fixer in that realm of financial leadership, it means a lot of people skills that we often neglect in finance and accounting. I would agree. How did you sharpen those skills, right? The soft. So you, you explained a bit about how you sharpen your strategic skills, but then the soft skills, right?

How do you get people to move when they don't report to you? When you're not doing their performance review, I can give them a raise. How do you become that strategic influencer on the people side?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: I think you have to show your personality box, you know, for those that have that, you really have to hone in on that.

And what I mean is, Go to the lunches that you're invited to or invite those to go to lunch with you so I can get to know you a little differently outside of your background. Attend the company dinners and that, those type of things. Not forcibly, you know, enjoy it. Like I happen to enjoy doing those things when I, my schedule allows me.

So that way they can see you in a different light. And then when you are in the meetings and the discussions, participate, not just sit there and take it all in, have a voice to add to the conversation so they can also get to know you a little better and your personality and, you know, maybe bring up things that are personal that you're willing to share so they can get you to know you a little better and see you in a different way.

What I learned a long time ago when I was first starting out leadership is when someone trusts you, and this is like business or personal. The lines of communication will remain open, the communication will flow. I just try to build those relationships so that they begin to trust what I'm helping them with and then, you know, they'll start to come to you for solutions.

Wassia Kamon: Yes, I love it.

And the reason I say I love this because when I started my role as a CFO, so right now I'm in like in my 90 days as we're recording this, one of the things I realized, yes, is you have to build that trust quickly. Because you come in and there is stuff to fix. You come in, there is relationships to build, there is inputs needed here and there.

What are some of your advice for newbie number one right here on this call to build that trust quickly? Like you don't have time, you were just hired. What are some of the quick things that you will say will help building that trust, building that credibility?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: You got to get allies and allies do not always come in the form of your direct peers.

They can come from those below. What I would recommend is you start to set up meetings and have conversations with the levels below. Those middle managers, those working staff that's moving the company forward every day on the front line,

talk

to them, ask them what their needs are, the things that they have seen that can be improved in the organization.

And begin to craft yourself a list, and I call it an opportunities list. Whenever I start a new role, I don't call it the problem, I call it an opportunity list.

And

that list is built or developed by me having conversations and getting the insight and perspectives of different levels in the company.

Wassia Kamon: That's awesome. I usually call Mike the hit list. So I like, I will use the opportunity list moving forward. Thank you so much. Now follow up on that is the hit list or the opportunity list tend to get longer and longer. Okay. I started with a little book, then got on Excel, then on posting notes. And it's kind of hard at some point to get organized with all the things that come now under the umbrella of a CFO, right?

You have to know a little bit about IT, a little bit of HR, a little bit about everything.

So how do you keep yourself organized?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: That is a great question. I am an organized person, so to not be, I will begin to itch. I use a lot of Not as high tech things as you may think, but I use a Gantt chart. I use all inclusive agendas.

When I have one on ones with my teams, I share the agendas and like SharePoint so that they can add to, it's a fluid document that really helps keep us organized because they can add to the agendas and things we need to discuss and keep everyone accountable

and

on track, but, um, the Gantt charts really work with.

me a lot. And so things that I need to follow up on and manage even for, you know, for my own to do, the Gantt charts really helped me in terms of moving things from that opportunities list. That's all about prioritization. So whenever, you know, we're in a strategic planning period, things that are on that list that really need to be focused on.

I prioritize those in terms of adding them to our strategic plan and getting the buy in

Wassia Kamon: of

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: my peers to also make it say, yes, we think that needs to be a priority.

Wassia Kamon: Okay,

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: so that's how I've been able to move certain things off of that list. Now, other things on the opportunities list, I would say most things on the opportunity list are more tactical, operational driven, things you just need to accomplish and get done with your staff and building things and improving things.

The more strategic things outwardly facing require that partnership of your colleagues. Because it's, you know, more organization pushing the organization forward and not just improving things in within the operational financial realm. So it's a little bit of both moving things from that opportunities list can be a day to day tactical and some things prioritize within the strategic plan.

Wassia Kamon: In that I can see how there is part, like you said, where you need your peers and part where you need your team and how do you build a high performing team, a team that you probably mentor, you coach, that that's there for you, a team that's able and capable, have the capacity to carry that opportunities forward, how, what are some tips there?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: What's really tough is when you're a new leader coming in and you inherit your team. I've never been a leader that comes in, like, throw the, that, what's that saying? Throw the baby out the bathwater or whatever that is. Fill the ranks. Yeah, never that. But you do want to come in and observe the skill set.

And if the skill set is not up to par, identify what those weaknesses are and get them the training that they may need, whatever that gap is. If that's still not working, then, you know, there's some tough conversations that probably need to be had and then, you know, move on from there. Either way, you're going to come back to the same result.

To build that high performing team, you have to have the, give the team the tools they need to do their job, whether that's the skill set or training, technology,

whatever

that is. They will not be able to do the job in the way that you think it needs to be done to move the company forward until they are provided all of those things.

And then once they have that support. They need continued support from you. They need your buy in. They need things. They need help if they're trying to get through to colleagues. They need the support of their CFO to back them in what they're asking for. And that support. I can't tell you enough. how much that builds trust with your team when you can give them that support when they're trying to get things done outside of your division or outside of their department.

That really goes a long way, uh, and they will stick beside you. They'll perform.

Wassia Kamon: I love it. Getting the tools they need to perform.

One thing you had shared to on LinkedIn was how you were sharing the successes of your division as well to the executive team. Can you please share more about that as well?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: So being a finance and accounting and operational leader, we're not so much typically client facing. We are focused on the business. And that has internal and external impact. And so it's not always so overt or where everyone in the organization can see the, or feel the impact of what you do a lot of times.

Even those internally, you know, the top, your boss, your sideways. And so if you're not commun it is really up to you to communicate. I don't assume they know they could, let's assume they don't, it's really your ownness, your responsibility to communicate what your team has accomplished. They should require that of you to push their accomplishments and make them exposed.

Because when it's on paper, let me tell you, it's eye opening, especially for someone on the outside looking in, your peers. The top president CEO when they see it on paper. It's like, Oh, wow. Okay. Well, we thought you were busy, but this is really confirming it. And thank you for pushing things along, you know, in this way, what we do, what we lead.

You may not realize the train is moving because we're just so good at that, but when it's something goes wrong, they really know that. Miss a

Wassia Kamon: paycheck. Miss a quarterly reporting. Yes. There will be notice when things are wrong. That is so true. And I love how you are very intentional about, if I can say bragging and sharing about your team because what I realized too, it's easier to get funding on training when people know what's going on.

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: Absolutely. Yep. Yep. And you know, your team is really what makes it happen. So you really have to highlight the things that they've done.

Wassia Kamon: And now as a CFO, I know you mentioned you give them the tool, you give them the time. And as a new CFO, I'm like, whoo, my time is like, whoo, whoo. Where is the time? So.

What are some of the things that help you still be involved in your team and involved with the rest of your organization when it comes to time? Do you rely on consultant, executive coaches? Like, what does it look like for you to be able to achieve this, that balance?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: For me, I really get, achieve that balance through my one on one discussions I have with my staff during the month.

That's just a time where I can give them dedicated attention. And I always tell them, they rely on me to craft that agenda. That's why I share, I'm like, no, this is your time. You have some things I may need to talk about that come up during the week or the month. But this is really your time for you to share the things you need to share.

Get that time with me for consulting, whatever it is. This is your time, so make the agenda what you need it to be. And I also make sure that they understand, I'm not just available during your one on one. Like, if you need me outside of that time, You absolutely let me know. We can schedule a separate call, a meeting, whatever

Wassia Kamon: that looks like.

I like how you said, the one on one is your time. That's something that I wish I had known earlier. That how you use your one on one with your boss, with your peers, like just that, that whole thing about one on one is something you can really use to accelerate your career. You really

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: can. Yeah. And don't just have the one on ones with your boss, with the up and down.

Have them with the sideways, your colleagues as well. Going back to your question about being new in your role, and I said, you know, have meetings with everyone. Another thing that I did was make sure that I had, I don't do them so much as now, I've been almost three years here, but having that routine discussion with that VP level that's right below the C suite, because you need to understand the things that they're putting forward.

And that they're leading in those other divisions and departments. And so I would have one on ones with them routinely, not just when I was starting out learning. I had, probably for the first year, I had a monthly one on one with those, those VPs.

Wassia Kamon: Nice, that's awesome.

With all that, what would be like one piece of wisdom that you want to pass along to the next generation of leaders?

Because I love your story. I love how you talked about a mentor, really your boss that spoke something into your life that got you to, yes, I want to be CF when you went for it. Like what are some of the things that you can share with, you know, aspiring leaders?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: What I would say is you can do it, own what you know.

What I mean by that is when you really, really know something, be steadfast in that. You got it. Don't let anyone make you think that you don't have it, that you don't have that knowledge because you do, and just be strong in that right and know that you can, you can do it. Secondly, I would also say, don't be afraid to move to different industries.

That's really worked for me. I recommend that because when you are in finance and accounting, that's one beauty of being in this career field is you can move in and out like a chameleon to different industries and apply your skill set. Because if you think about, we really are consultants, internal consultants and strategic consultants.

And if you think about the consulting industry. They consult with many clients in a lot of varied industries because of why people desire or seek out the knowledge that you have about the craft, not the industry so much.

Wassia Kamon: I love that. I actually never saw it that way, but it is so true because you bring with you that breadth, I should say, of perspective to really any transactions.

Thank you so much for sharing. My last question for you would be What's your advice to other CFOs, right? There's a lot of things going on, whether it's with AI, with, oh my gosh, the economy. You've been in banking, so you know the, the impact of interest rates on so many things. What do you think CFOs should pay attention to in this environment?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: Wow, you know, you have to be data driven. I'm a data driven CFO. I like to make informed decisions by using data and not assumptions, data driven, and solutions based. Don't complain about all the problems that you see and it has to be fixed fine and identify and bring those solutions forward. Recommend the right solutions.

Those solutions may not not always get the funding or the prioritization. It is our job to make the upper levels understand. That would need why we need to prioritize them, but they may not always get the funding because they're competing with a lot of other things, but bring those solutions forward and not just point out what the problems are.

That is not going to get you far at all. You have to bring the solution. And the reason I mentioned the data driving it is because that can't be negotiated when you have that data that's informing because that's a part of the package of identifying that solution and getting the buy in for the solution.

Wassia Kamon: Can you drill a little deeper into what you just said about data driven and solution based? Like, can you provide an example? Something that to really bring it home when you say a data driven and solution based CFO.

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: The data, looking at all the reports and the different analytics that's set up in your dashboard and all those things that you're looking at and analyzing in the results.

Things

that you're seeing in the market, because CFOs need to study the market as well, you're not just internal. Looking at all that information and what the data is and information is telling us. For example, you're analyzing some monthly results. Even if on the business intelligence side, not just the financial data points.

If our results are telling us that clients that are leading in one industry are doing really well, performing well that year, you know what, we need to focus on that industry more. What's happening in that industry that we just sold X amount of dollars of product to these clients that's really carrying us this year in this industry.

What's going on in that industry. So it helps you to focus on the right things and make decisions based on that information. Love it. Yes. That's what I mean about data driven, using that information you have.

Wassia Kamon: That's awesome. And I love how you say, you have to know what's going on in the market, not just your market, but what about the market of your biggest customers, right?

Because if something goes wrong with them, it's going to come back to you. And you won't be

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: able to sell to them, correct.

Wassia Kamon: Yes. So love that perspective. Oh my goodness. Do you have anything else to say? Cause I took notes. You cannot see my notes. I took so many notes from this episode. Thank you so much for being on the show.

Any last thing you would like to share with us today?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: I think if I left it on the table, say what you mean and mean what you say. I'm always saying that. Say what you mean and mean what you say. Wow, that takes a lot of courage and confidence to do that. Well, you know what? I'm glad you mentioned that because female CFOs We have to have that confidence is typically a position reserved for males.

And I will go so far as to say white males. So, um, you know, I'm an African American CFO female and my journey has not been always an easy one. I do have that confidence to speak on the things that I've shared with you. And so that is why I really believe in saying what you mean, but it's how you say it.

But say what you mean and

Wassia Kamon: mean what you say. Wow, love it. And any advice now, now that you said it, I told you. The more you speak, the more I'll be asking questions. Okay, last, last question. Any advice for the female CFOs now, now that you said, and it's very true, our path is going to be different, we're wired differently, and the roles are being traditionally almost tailored, fit.

for males. So how do you build that confidence? How do you build the strength, the courage, the boldness to do that? Well, you

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: got to start with knowing

Wassia Kamon: your

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: stuff, get that craft, really, really get all the education you need, whatever that means for you, the licensing. All of those things to help you to support your path.

Okay? You gotta get the education and then you gotta really make sure you get that experience. Don't give up on that. Putting yourself in the roles and the positions to get that experience. Put in the hours, put in the work so that you're seen. So once you have that craft really strong and developed, then you know you ready for those leadership roles.

You gotta develop that skillset. That's a whole nother level. And getting leadership skills, but it's always a it's a continuous education once you've got those down and you're really strong and confident in that right, you know, you can confidently move forward in that to arm yourself against those who will try to make you think that you don't have it.

And when you know you do have it, you can easily combat the naysayers.

Wassia Kamon: Oh, that's awesome. I love it. Some of the things that helped me, at least in my career, most recently was working with an executive coach and having my finance sisterhood community where we, we, we, we help each other.

Have you also had those kind of help?

Or are you like, oh, I'm doing this?

Brenda Hodo-Iddris: Oh, no, I've had, um, I've had executive coaches along the way over the years. I've had leadership development. I belong to organizations, different financial or leadership organizations to bounce things off of. We don't know everything and, and it's always evolving.

Learning is always evolving. Oh yeah. So, you know, I belong to the leadership CFO council. Oh nice. That is a really, really great organization for CFOs to come together. Get insights, bounce ideas off of when new things emerge in the economy within the organization. Like recently, I was, well, maybe a year or so ago, I was developing a deposit structure.

It's time for us to implement a deposit requirement for certain clients, for certain size deals. In our industry, I wanted to learn a little bit more about what's typical for this type of structure in our industry. So I started asking folks, you know, within the groups and, you know, just in chats and getting some insight that way, that type of network and community can really help you even be stronger.

When you're looking for reference points, you got to have a, a community around you. Always belong to some type of financial group. Another good one that I belong, I was a member for four years. It's Association for Finance Professionals.

Wassia Kamon: Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. That's awesome. A really good group

Wassia Kamon: Yeah. Yes. And yes, I've been part of the CFO Leadership Council.

Just getting the chat and seeing the kind of questions others ask. Right. Um, has been very helpful. Yep. You can get some nuggets and takeaways. Yes. Things you never consider and you're like, Ooh, I never thought about this issue and I wouldn't know what to do if I was faced with it. So definitely a great group.

You're so right. Thank you so much, Brenda.

That's it for today's episode of the Diary of the CFO. Thank you so much, Brenda, for all the great advice and insight you shared. I'm sure this will definitely help other leaders become better leaders and be better at life. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for being here.

If you enjoyed this episode as much as I did, don't forget to subscribe, like, and share it with family and friends and actually leave a review. Okay, I'm going to pause right here. I need reviews guys, please. Don't forget to do that. And if you have any topics that you would like me to cover or any special guests you would like to recommend.

On this podcast, please send an email to ask at the diary of a CFO that come again. The email is ask at the diary of the CFO that come. All right. Can't wait to see you soon. Cheers.