In this episode of The Diary of a CFO: Live in Atlanta, I sit down in person with Tiffany Willis.
Tiffany is a global investor relations executive who recently served as Senior Vice President at Starbucks, where she managed nearly $130 billion in market capitalization. She is a Wharton graduate, an Adjunct Professor at Emory University's Goizueta Business School, a CPA, a Lean Six Sigma Black Belt, and a former Miss Black Georgia USA.
Behind that bio is a story most people would never expect. Tiffany was pregnant at 14, dropped out of school in the 9th grade, and was homeless. She kept her baby's milk on a windowsill because she had no refrigerator.
We talk about what carried her through that chapter and into boardrooms with Howard Schultz and Mellody Hobson. How she transitioned from public accounting into investor relations and why that shift required a completely different way of thinking.
The art of storytelling as a finance leader and why most finance professionals struggle with it. Her swimming pool analogy for how to make numbers feel real to non-finance people.
The WIFM framework she uses to get buy-in across every function. How being Miss Black Georgia USA gave her the communication foundation she uses in boardrooms today.
And why she wrote her book Own Your Narrative to help leaders stop hiding from their story and start leading from it.
Get Tiffany's book, Own Your Narrative: https://www.amazon.com/Own-Your-Narrative-Resilience-Restored/dp/1918077835/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 We are live in Atlanta, and this is the Diary
00:00:02 --> 00:00:08 of a CFO. I'm your host, Wassia Kamon, and I've
00:00:08 --> 00:00:11 called this city my home for over two decades.
00:00:11 --> 00:00:14 It's one of the most important business hubs
00:00:14 --> 00:00:17 in the country. More than $2 trillion in payments
00:00:17 --> 00:00:20 flow through Atlanta every year, with an estimated
00:00:20 --> 00:00:23 70 % of all U .S. credit card transactions touching
00:00:23 --> 00:00:27 the city. Yet, most of the business conversation
00:00:27 --> 00:00:29 is still centered on places like New York and
00:00:29 --> 00:00:32 San Francisco. So I'm trying to change that with
00:00:32 --> 00:00:34 this limited series where I'm sitting down in
00:00:34 --> 00:00:37 person with CFOs and senior finance leaders right
00:00:37 --> 00:00:40 here in Atlanta to talk about how they build
00:00:40 --> 00:00:42 their careers, what's working, what's different
00:00:42 --> 00:00:46 about doing it here, so that we can better understand
00:00:46 --> 00:00:49 the human beings behind the big title. Let's
00:00:49 --> 00:00:52 get in. So today I'm so excited to have here
00:00:52 --> 00:00:55 Tiffany Willis. Tiffany is a global investor
00:00:55 --> 00:00:58 relations executive, recently serving as senior
00:00:58 --> 00:01:01 vice president at Starbucks, where she managed
00:01:01 --> 00:01:04 nearly $130 billion in market capitalization
00:01:04 --> 00:01:06 and directed Starbucks' Wall Street engagement
00:01:06 --> 00:01:09 and financial communication strategy. With a
00:01:09 --> 00:01:12 career spanning from big four accounting, finance
00:01:12 --> 00:01:15 operations, and risk management, she brings a
00:01:15 --> 00:01:18 rare combination of technical expertise and strategic
00:01:18 --> 00:01:21 influence to the C -suite. She's a CPA, a Lean
00:01:21 --> 00:01:24 Six Sigma Black Belt, and a graduate of Advanced
00:01:24 --> 00:01:27 Management Program at Wharton Business School.
00:01:27 --> 00:01:30 She also holds an MBA from Emory University,
00:01:30 --> 00:01:33 and now she also teaches at Emory University
00:01:33 --> 00:01:36 as an adjunct professor. Beyond the numbers,
00:01:36 --> 00:01:39 Tiffany is a sought -after keynote speaker, former
00:01:39 --> 00:01:42 Miss Black Georgia USA, and a trusted advisor
00:01:42 --> 00:01:46 to boards and executives, helping leaders turn
00:01:46 --> 00:01:48 high stake pressure into a strategic advantage.
00:01:49 --> 00:01:52 Thank you so much for being here, Tiffany. Thank
00:01:52 --> 00:01:55 you for having me. It's an absolute honor. Oh
00:01:55 --> 00:01:57 gosh, I've waited for this moment for you don't
00:01:57 --> 00:02:02 even know how long. So thank you for being part
00:02:02 --> 00:02:05 of this series, Live in Atlanta. So my first
00:02:05 --> 00:02:07 question for you, of course, would be what brought
00:02:07 --> 00:02:10 you to Atlanta? Yeah, so I actually came to Atlanta
00:02:10 --> 00:02:12 from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and it was with
00:02:12 --> 00:02:15 a transfer with PwC. So I started my career with
00:02:15 --> 00:02:18 the firm PwC, and at the time I was in the Pittsburgh
00:02:18 --> 00:02:21 office. And when an opportunity rose, they tapped
00:02:21 --> 00:02:23 me on the shoulder and asked if I would relocate
00:02:23 --> 00:02:25 to Atlanta. And so I've come to Atlanta, and
00:02:25 --> 00:02:29 I've been here now over 20 -ish years, probably
00:02:29 --> 00:02:33 25 now. Yeah, I like to say I'm 25 years old.
00:02:34 --> 00:02:37 But the math is no longer mathing. Because I've
00:02:37 --> 00:02:40 been here about that long too. So you said yes,
00:02:40 --> 00:02:43 you came here. But at some point you moved from
00:02:43 --> 00:02:45 public accounting to investor relations. Yes.
00:02:46 --> 00:02:48 What prompted that transition and what was the
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 transition like? Because it's a big change. Yes,
00:02:50 --> 00:02:53 a huge change. And so being in public accounting,
00:02:53 --> 00:02:56 it's really like you're in the field of... Pure
00:02:56 --> 00:02:59 accounting. Going into investor relations, it's
00:02:59 --> 00:03:02 this combination of finance, strategy, communication.
00:03:03 --> 00:03:05 So it almost uses different sides of how you
00:03:05 --> 00:03:07 think. But for me, it was really always saying
00:03:07 --> 00:03:10 yes to special projects. As I grew in my career,
00:03:10 --> 00:03:12 whether it was in Big Four, whether it was in
00:03:12 --> 00:03:14 industry, whenever there was something extra
00:03:14 --> 00:03:17 that needed done, I always raised my hand. And
00:03:17 --> 00:03:20 so that ultimately allowed me to be tapped for
00:03:20 --> 00:03:23 the investor relations role. Wow. That's impressive
00:03:23 --> 00:03:26 because you've done it at different companies.
00:03:26 --> 00:03:29 And a lot of people don't realize what being
00:03:29 --> 00:03:31 in investor relations really is because you're
00:03:31 --> 00:03:34 like the bridge between the public company and
00:03:34 --> 00:03:36 Wall Street. So tell us a bit more about. What
00:03:36 --> 00:03:38 does that role actually look like in reality?
00:03:39 --> 00:03:41 Yeah. So a lot of people, when they think of
00:03:41 --> 00:03:42 investor relations, they think of the person
00:03:42 --> 00:03:46 behind the earnings calls. Yes. And that's just
00:03:46 --> 00:03:48 one part of it. So I'm definitely writing the
00:03:48 --> 00:03:52 scripts for our CFOs, our CEOs. I'm helping tell
00:03:52 --> 00:03:54 the story in terms of what's our performance,
00:03:54 --> 00:03:57 but also what's coming next. What's our new innovation?
00:03:57 --> 00:04:00 Why should Wall Street be excited? Why should
00:04:00 --> 00:04:03 they either hold our stock or buy more? And so
00:04:03 --> 00:04:05 my job is not just to tell the story of the numbers.
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 but get them really excited about the strategy
00:04:07 --> 00:04:09 and how that's going to manifest into results.
00:04:10 --> 00:04:12 Another part of investor relations, though, is
00:04:12 --> 00:04:15 making sure that internally our employees know
00:04:15 --> 00:04:18 what we're doing because we need them galvanized
00:04:18 --> 00:04:20 around the strategy because they're the ones
00:04:20 --> 00:04:22 that's going to help us produce the results to
00:04:22 --> 00:04:25 meet Wall Street's expectations. And then another
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 piece of my role is really just being the storyteller,
00:04:27 --> 00:04:30 the cheerleader from the company to Wall Street,
00:04:30 --> 00:04:32 but then also making sure that I'm bringing the
00:04:32 --> 00:04:35 Wall Street sentiment. back to the company. So
00:04:35 --> 00:04:39 the C -suite leaders understand how our investors
00:04:39 --> 00:04:40 are thinking, how our shareholders are thinking,
00:04:41 --> 00:04:43 and then also how our competitors are showing
00:04:43 --> 00:04:46 up for them. So we can use that intel as we think
00:04:46 --> 00:04:48 about how we're executing against our strategy.
00:04:48 --> 00:04:51 Wow, that's a lot of working with different people
00:04:51 --> 00:04:54 in different areas. And your background is like
00:04:54 --> 00:04:58 mine, accounting. How did you learn? Like, how
00:04:58 --> 00:05:02 did you become comfortable with... Because now
00:05:02 --> 00:05:04 it's one of the most on -demand skill when you
00:05:04 --> 00:05:07 think about AI. Like, how did you get there and
00:05:07 --> 00:05:10 be comfortable in those boardrooms? Yeah. So
00:05:10 --> 00:05:12 I think part of, you know, the storytelling piece,
00:05:13 --> 00:05:16 I always say people think a beauty queen, like
00:05:16 --> 00:05:18 what experience does that have? What experience
00:05:18 --> 00:05:20 and how is that relevant? It's very relevant
00:05:20 --> 00:05:22 for me because that's where I had on the ground
00:05:22 --> 00:05:26 training for communications. I served representing
00:05:26 --> 00:05:29 the state of Georgia for a whole year as Miss
00:05:29 --> 00:05:32 Black Georgia USA. And so it was constant. the
00:05:32 --> 00:05:35 speeches and communicating and standing behind
00:05:35 --> 00:05:39 a mic and standing behind a podium. And so that
00:05:39 --> 00:05:42 was on the ground communications training. And
00:05:42 --> 00:05:43 so now when I'm in a role where I'm storytelling
00:05:43 --> 00:05:47 and now the content is numbers and finance, I'm
00:05:47 --> 00:05:49 just bridging both of those worlds together.
00:05:50 --> 00:05:53 Nice. So for the people like, you know, asking
00:05:53 --> 00:05:56 for a friend here who cannot be at this point,
00:05:56 --> 00:06:01 Miss Georgia USA. Sure you could. So for those
00:06:01 --> 00:06:03 who can be at that level, like what would you
00:06:03 --> 00:06:05 say some of the steps they can take to improve
00:06:05 --> 00:06:09 their storytelling skills? Yeah. So when I think
00:06:09 --> 00:06:11 of storytelling, there's a lot of different avenues.
00:06:11 --> 00:06:15 One, I think people are just scared. speak in
00:06:15 --> 00:06:17 public. So that's part of it, right? There is
00:06:17 --> 00:06:20 the whole comfort piece. So there's a lot of
00:06:20 --> 00:06:22 tools out there, the Toastmasters, the things
00:06:22 --> 00:06:25 like that. But the other piece is just knowing
00:06:25 --> 00:06:27 your content and being able to speak. I always
00:06:27 --> 00:06:30 say, if you cannot sell yourself, how can you
00:06:30 --> 00:06:31 sell the numbers that you're presenting in front
00:06:31 --> 00:06:34 of someone, right? And so, so often people think
00:06:34 --> 00:06:36 about that when you're interviewing. And the
00:06:36 --> 00:06:39 question is, tell me about yourself. If you cannot
00:06:39 --> 00:06:42 answer that question, How are you going to then
00:06:42 --> 00:06:45 be in a role that is a finance leader or CFO
00:06:45 --> 00:06:49 and now sell the CEO on this tweak to the capital
00:06:49 --> 00:06:51 allocation strategy? How are you going to sell
00:06:51 --> 00:06:54 the board on why this acquisition should be at
00:06:54 --> 00:06:58 X valuation versus Y and you're seeking their
00:06:58 --> 00:07:01 approval? If you cannot even sell yourself in,
00:07:01 --> 00:07:03 tell me about yourself in a resume question,
00:07:03 --> 00:07:06 I mean, in an interview question, then that's
00:07:06 --> 00:07:08 kind of the start of the storytelling. And so
00:07:08 --> 00:07:11 I always say when you're storytelling, it doesn't
00:07:11 --> 00:07:14 matter what it is that you're telling. The objective
00:07:14 --> 00:07:17 you should have is for the person to buy what
00:07:17 --> 00:07:20 you're selling, right? Even if it's not something
00:07:20 --> 00:07:23 physical. It could be the financials. It could
00:07:23 --> 00:07:24 be the guidance you want to go out with next
00:07:24 --> 00:07:27 year. Whatever it is you want someone to quote
00:07:27 --> 00:07:30 -unquote buy, you have to be good at selling
00:07:30 --> 00:07:32 it. And I think so often as finance leaders,
00:07:32 --> 00:07:34 especially in the CFO wheelhouse, we're so used
00:07:34 --> 00:07:37 to the numbers. Especially as you grow up through
00:07:37 --> 00:07:39 your career, it's all about let me put the spreadsheet
00:07:39 --> 00:07:41 together, let me make sure it ticks and ties
00:07:41 --> 00:07:44 and it looks beautiful. But now as you elevate,
00:07:44 --> 00:07:46 you have to be able to tell the story behind
00:07:46 --> 00:07:50 those numbers. You have to be able to sell yourself.
00:07:50 --> 00:07:52 Wow, I never thought about it that way. And if
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 you can't sell yourself and you know yourself
00:07:54 --> 00:07:57 best, how are you going to sell some financials?
00:07:57 --> 00:08:00 Yeah. Right? So I think just bringing it back
00:08:00 --> 00:08:04 to something so fundamental. And I always say
00:08:04 --> 00:08:06 it could be the most simplest thing. that you
00:08:06 --> 00:08:08 have to sell, but you have to get used to it
00:08:08 --> 00:08:11 by exercising that muscle, right? For example,
00:08:11 --> 00:08:15 if I wanted to sell you a pool, I could tell
00:08:15 --> 00:08:18 you that there's this pool and it's 20 feet deep
00:08:18 --> 00:08:22 and 10 feet or 20 feet wide and 10 feet deep,
00:08:22 --> 00:08:25 right? And you're like, okay, I can visualize
00:08:25 --> 00:08:28 this pool that's 20 feet wide and 10 feet deep.
00:08:29 --> 00:08:31 And that's what we do as finance professionals.
00:08:32 --> 00:08:33 We go in with our spreadsheet and we're like,
00:08:33 --> 00:08:37 this is what we have, a pool 20 feet wide and
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 10 feet deep. But what we want to do and what
00:08:39 --> 00:08:41 we want to get people to be comfortable with
00:08:41 --> 00:08:44 is coming in saying, we have this swimming pool
00:08:44 --> 00:08:49 and it's so wide that Michael Phelps can do laps
00:08:49 --> 00:08:52 from start to finish. Oh, where is that pool?
00:08:53 --> 00:08:56 And then if someone doesn't want to do laps and
00:08:56 --> 00:08:59 they just want to practice their diving. This
00:08:59 --> 00:09:00 pool is deep enough for someone to be able to
00:09:00 --> 00:09:03 dive into the pool, and their toes would barely
00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 scratch the surface on the bottom of the pool.
00:09:07 --> 00:09:10 But it's also wide enough and has enough parameter
00:09:10 --> 00:09:12 around it that if you just want to sit on the
00:09:12 --> 00:09:15 side and sunbathe, you can, and when that person
00:09:15 --> 00:09:17 that's diving in the pool, you'll barely get
00:09:17 --> 00:09:21 wet as you get your suntan. In this pool, the
00:09:21 --> 00:09:23 water is so crystal clear that you'll just see
00:09:23 --> 00:09:26 a glistening blue that you'll almost think that
00:09:26 --> 00:09:29 you're looking at an ocean. But it's really just
00:09:29 --> 00:09:31 the swimming pool. And that's the difference
00:09:31 --> 00:09:36 in presenting numbers, a swimming pool 20 feet
00:09:36 --> 00:09:40 wide, 10 feet deep, or a story and storytelling
00:09:40 --> 00:09:42 and the art of storytelling and how it helps
00:09:42 --> 00:09:45 with persuasion and allowing people to enter
00:09:45 --> 00:09:48 into what you're trying to sell, which is then,
00:09:48 --> 00:09:51 in essence, what we need as finance executives.
00:09:51 --> 00:09:54 Yes, because they have to buy. Into you, right?
00:09:54 --> 00:09:56 That you need their buy -in before they can buy
00:09:56 --> 00:10:00 in the numbers and what you say. And I love that
00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 analogy of the pool. What are some things that
00:10:02 --> 00:10:04 helped you refine this? Because you were talking
00:10:04 --> 00:10:06 about it and I was like, wow, I need a pool.
00:10:06 --> 00:10:09 The summer is coming up. Well, you know, just
00:10:09 --> 00:10:13 the role of investor relations, one. My job is
00:10:13 --> 00:10:17 to sell the company, right? Every day I'm talking
00:10:17 --> 00:10:21 with investors and analysts and... they only
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 have what I would call a basket. They only have
00:10:23 --> 00:10:25 so much capacity in their basket to hold stock.
00:10:26 --> 00:10:28 So if you think about a basket and you think
00:10:28 --> 00:10:30 about eggs in a basket, there's only so many
00:10:30 --> 00:10:33 eggs that can fit. So my job is to convince you
00:10:33 --> 00:10:35 to move some of those other eggs out the basket
00:10:35 --> 00:10:38 and make room for mine. And if you have some
00:10:38 --> 00:10:40 of my eggs in your basket, let's move some of
00:10:40 --> 00:10:42 the other eggs out so you can add more of mine.
00:10:43 --> 00:10:45 And so you have to be compelling in that story
00:10:45 --> 00:10:48 if you want people then to react to what you
00:10:48 --> 00:10:51 want them to do. And so that's really just been
00:10:51 --> 00:10:55 a natural thing for me based on my roles of just
00:10:55 --> 00:10:57 trying to make sure that whatever the intent,
00:10:57 --> 00:11:00 the message is, that it resonates. And I found
00:11:00 --> 00:11:04 that people react to something they can visualize,
00:11:04 --> 00:11:07 something they can feel, something they can smell,
00:11:07 --> 00:11:11 touch, even if it's just imaginary touching more
00:11:11 --> 00:11:14 than they respond to just a number on the page.
00:11:14 --> 00:11:17 Yes. But sometimes it's also hard because you
00:11:17 --> 00:11:20 can walk into a high stick meetings. And something
00:11:20 --> 00:11:22 can go wrong because they saw something on the
00:11:22 --> 00:11:26 news, some strike, I mean, whatever it is. And
00:11:26 --> 00:11:29 so when you walk into those big meetings where
00:11:29 --> 00:11:32 you have to make that sale of, you know, pick
00:11:32 --> 00:11:35 me, put me in your basket, what are you usually
00:11:35 --> 00:11:38 looking for maybe to tweak your narrative or
00:11:38 --> 00:11:39 adapt your narrative or what tells you something
00:11:39 --> 00:11:42 wrong is about to happen and you need to kind
00:11:42 --> 00:11:45 of change your strategy? So I think the biggest
00:11:45 --> 00:11:48 thing in that type of situation, and I've had
00:11:48 --> 00:11:52 it, You have to be prepared for what you're not
00:11:52 --> 00:11:55 saying, but what's going to be asked. And so
00:11:55 --> 00:11:57 when you go in and you're trying to make sure
00:11:57 --> 00:11:59 that you're communicating and you're persuading
00:11:59 --> 00:12:02 people, you have to also play devil's advocate.
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 Well, what would this person say? Well, why wouldn't
00:12:06 --> 00:12:09 they want this? Well, why would they push back
00:12:09 --> 00:12:11 on this? And you have to already have those answers.
00:12:12 --> 00:12:14 So when the questions come, it's not stumbling
00:12:14 --> 00:12:16 you. It's, you know what, that's a great question.
00:12:16 --> 00:12:18 I actually thought about that when I was pulling
00:12:18 --> 00:12:21 together this proposal. And the reason we didn't
00:12:21 --> 00:12:23 go that route is because A, B, and C, right?
00:12:23 --> 00:12:26 So it's not a, let me think about it. It's a,
00:12:26 --> 00:12:29 I thought about that. And the reason we didn't
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 go with that, or I thought about it, and this
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 is how we incorporated some of that, right? So
00:12:34 --> 00:12:38 then you are also being perceived as someone
00:12:38 --> 00:12:40 that's prepared, someone that's comprehensive.
00:12:41 --> 00:12:43 Someone that thought through the different avenues,
00:12:43 --> 00:12:45 the different takes and puts. And so that's important
00:12:45 --> 00:12:49 as well, because then your story is more compelling
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 because now they feel like she's buttoned up
00:12:51 --> 00:12:55 from top to bottom. Yes. Yes. But sometimes the
00:12:55 --> 00:12:57 adversity is not coming necessarily from the
00:12:57 --> 00:12:59 other side, like the investors. Sometimes you
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01 walk into a group, you are supposed in the group
00:13:01 --> 00:13:04 is your company, but you are in a group and people
00:13:04 --> 00:13:07 have different views on a topic and you're supposed
00:13:07 --> 00:13:11 to have. a unified front. Like how do you craft
00:13:11 --> 00:13:14 a unified narrative in those situations? Yeah.
00:13:14 --> 00:13:16 So the one thing, and I remember this all the
00:13:16 --> 00:13:18 way from B school, but it was a book around the
00:13:18 --> 00:13:20 six thinking hats. And when you come up with
00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 a decision, you have to put the hat on of all
00:13:22 --> 00:13:24 the different functions. So you're in finance,
00:13:24 --> 00:13:27 but how's this going to impact HR? How's this
00:13:27 --> 00:13:29 going to impact IT? How's it going to impact
00:13:29 --> 00:13:31 my supply chain? How's it going to impact marketing?
00:13:31 --> 00:13:33 Right. And thinking through that. So when you're
00:13:33 --> 00:13:35 in meetings and it's a cross -functional and
00:13:35 --> 00:13:38 you need to kind of appear with a unified consensus
00:13:38 --> 00:13:40 in front that you've thought through those different
00:13:40 --> 00:13:44 avenues. The other thing is there's so much value
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46 in the meetings before the meetings. Oh, gosh.
00:13:47 --> 00:13:49 Yes. Even though we don't like them on the calendar.
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 Yes. We don't like the meetings before the meetings.
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 But there's value. So the decisions sometimes
00:13:54 --> 00:13:57 are made in those meetings before the meetings.
00:13:57 --> 00:13:59 Then the official meeting is just the readout.
00:14:01 --> 00:14:03 And so sometimes so often people will say, well,
00:14:03 --> 00:14:05 I know my idea is good. I've already thought
00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 through it. Oh, they're going to poke holes,
00:14:08 --> 00:14:09 but that's okay because this is the direction
00:14:09 --> 00:14:12 we need to go. But then you waste so much time
00:14:12 --> 00:14:15 in the meeting and you're not getting to what
00:14:15 --> 00:14:17 your objective is, which is approval, success,
00:14:17 --> 00:14:20 let's move forward. And so spending that time
00:14:20 --> 00:14:21 with the meetings before the meetings are important,
00:14:21 --> 00:14:24 but even before that, building relationships
00:14:24 --> 00:14:28 so those meetings before the meetings are fruitful.
00:14:28 --> 00:14:31 It's those relationships part, right? Because
00:14:31 --> 00:14:33 especially with people in finance and accounting,
00:14:34 --> 00:14:38 one of our favorite departments to love is sales
00:14:38 --> 00:14:41 and marketing. They always have the great ideas,
00:14:41 --> 00:14:44 and then we know how much is in the budget, and
00:14:44 --> 00:14:48 we're like, eh. You know. So how would you say,
00:14:48 --> 00:14:49 like, what are some of the things that helped
00:14:49 --> 00:14:51 you build those relationships over time with
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 all the, you know, cross -functionally? Yeah.
00:14:53 --> 00:14:57 I love the, just the analogy of WIFM. Have you
00:14:57 --> 00:15:01 heard of it before? No. So W -I -F -M. What's
00:15:01 --> 00:15:05 in it for me? Okay. Right? So WIFM. But the thought
00:15:05 --> 00:15:07 is, what's in it for me? But you're thinking
00:15:07 --> 00:15:10 from their perspective. Okay. So if I was sitting
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 in that marketing leader seat. and I was to propose
00:15:13 --> 00:15:16 this, or I gave a readout on this topic, they're
00:15:16 --> 00:15:20 going to say, well, what's in it for me? Without
00:15:20 --> 00:15:22 ever saying it verbally, that's what they're
00:15:22 --> 00:15:25 thinking. And so I start to think through that
00:15:25 --> 00:15:28 answer. So when I'm going and presenting it to
00:15:28 --> 00:15:31 them, I'm incorporating what's in it for them
00:15:31 --> 00:15:34 without them ever asking me, without them ever
00:15:34 --> 00:15:37 thinking through it. Nice. Hey, I know that we
00:15:37 --> 00:15:39 want to go out with this new marketing campaign,
00:15:40 --> 00:15:44 and I know you want to get it out. before X event.
00:15:45 --> 00:15:47 But I think we need to rethink it. And this is
00:15:47 --> 00:15:49 why I think we need to rethink it. But this is
00:15:49 --> 00:15:51 how I think it's going to be better from a marketing
00:15:51 --> 00:15:54 perspective. Because what we found is the ROI
00:15:54 --> 00:15:58 on X, Y, and Z event wasn't as beneficial as
00:15:58 --> 00:16:02 the Y event. And so I think from your perspective,
00:16:02 --> 00:16:05 right, from a marketing, you want as many eyeballs
00:16:05 --> 00:16:07 on this as possible. And you want this conversion
00:16:07 --> 00:16:09 rate to be as high as possible. So I think if
00:16:09 --> 00:16:11 we maybe pull back on the spending dollars now,
00:16:12 --> 00:16:15 And save them for later. It also happens to be
00:16:15 --> 00:16:17 the next quarter. So it helps just from a planning
00:16:17 --> 00:16:19 and budget perspective. But it also will get
00:16:19 --> 00:16:22 you more impressions, more eyeballs, more conversion.
00:16:22 --> 00:16:24 And I think that's what you're looking for ultimately.
00:16:25 --> 00:16:30 So you're putting it into their language. But
00:16:30 --> 00:16:32 you're also giving them a proposal. You don't
00:16:32 --> 00:16:34 want to spend that money this quarter. You don't
00:16:34 --> 00:16:37 have the budget. But they don't care about that.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:39 So you have to make sure you're presenting it
00:16:39 --> 00:16:42 in a way that's what's in it for them. Yes. And
00:16:42 --> 00:16:45 I definitely need, as you were talking, I'm like,
00:16:45 --> 00:16:49 how can I clone Tiffany and do like the rubbing
00:16:49 --> 00:16:52 genie and do like, rub Tiffany, help me before
00:16:52 --> 00:16:56 this meeting? You could call me anytime. Because
00:16:56 --> 00:17:00 that was so good. Because I feel it's often something
00:17:00 --> 00:17:03 we don't realize is relationships. And it ties
00:17:03 --> 00:17:05 back to what you said earlier about, can you
00:17:05 --> 00:17:09 sell yourself to be able to be in those relationships?
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 So I really wanted to start talking about your
00:17:12 --> 00:17:15 books on your narrative because I feel like it
00:17:15 --> 00:17:20 ties it all together. And curious to hear first,
00:17:20 --> 00:17:22 like what inspired you to write the book? Yeah.
00:17:22 --> 00:17:27 So for me, I do a lot of public speaking outside
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 of being a finance leader. And one of the things
00:17:29 --> 00:17:32 that I have found is in speaking, people initially
00:17:32 --> 00:17:37 may book me for finance topics. But when I talk
00:17:37 --> 00:17:39 a little bit about my personal journey. and how
00:17:39 --> 00:17:43 I went from early childhood up to my role and
00:17:43 --> 00:17:46 leading at the Fortune 100 level, it's the personal
00:17:46 --> 00:17:49 journey that allows people to lean in and connect
00:17:49 --> 00:17:53 with me. And so more and more speaking engagements,
00:17:53 --> 00:17:56 people would start to say, can you actually speak
00:17:56 --> 00:17:59 about X? Instead of finance, instead of the art
00:17:59 --> 00:18:02 of storytelling, can you come speak to our audience
00:18:02 --> 00:18:05 about resilience? Can you come speak to our audience
00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 about authentic leadership? And so there was
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 this need there. And then also people started
00:18:10 --> 00:18:13 saying, can we also not only book you, but can
00:18:13 --> 00:18:15 we buy copies of your book for the attendees?
00:18:15 --> 00:18:18 And I would always say, I don't have a book.
00:18:19 --> 00:18:21 And so the piece that really turned for me to
00:18:21 --> 00:18:24 say, let me get serious about the book is seeing
00:18:24 --> 00:18:27 how many people connect with my story and having
00:18:27 --> 00:18:29 one particular experience where I was in Wall
00:18:29 --> 00:18:33 Street for Juneteenth last year. And someone
00:18:33 --> 00:18:35 in the audience heard me speak and said, we have.
00:18:36 --> 00:18:39 to have you at our big global annual women's
00:18:39 --> 00:18:43 summit. It's 3 women. We have to make sure
00:18:43 --> 00:18:46 we have you. You're a female. You're a minority.
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48 You're in finance. You're an author. And she
00:18:48 --> 00:18:50 just kept going. And so I corrected her and said,
00:18:50 --> 00:18:52 oh, no, I'm not an author. And she said, you're
00:18:52 --> 00:18:54 not an author? And I said, no. She's like, oh,
00:18:54 --> 00:18:57 that's a criteria. Wow. Because then we sent
00:18:57 --> 00:18:59 her on this book. And in that moment, it made
00:18:59 --> 00:19:03 me realize. that I know people are carrying a
00:19:03 --> 00:19:06 weight that's invisible, and now I can't share
00:19:06 --> 00:19:08 my story to help someone carrying that weight.
00:19:08 --> 00:19:10 And people show up every day with that weight,
00:19:10 --> 00:19:13 and it impacts them, not only as a leader, but
00:19:13 --> 00:19:16 it impacts their team. Because in the event that
00:19:16 --> 00:19:19 you don't have weight when you come in, just
00:19:19 --> 00:19:22 know someone on your team does. And if you're
00:19:22 --> 00:19:25 not showing up in a way that allows them to feel
00:19:25 --> 00:19:28 lighter, they're not able to contribute their
00:19:28 --> 00:19:31 best. to their job, to the team members, their
00:19:31 --> 00:19:33 colleagues, and the company overall. And so that
00:19:33 --> 00:19:37 really was the turning point for me saying, not
00:19:37 --> 00:19:40 having a book is keeping me from lightening the
00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 weight that someone else that I don't know is
00:19:43 --> 00:19:47 carrying. Yes. And only so many people can listen
00:19:47 --> 00:19:52 to you at once, but a book you carry. Yes. Love
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 that story. And just to dive a little deeper,
00:19:55 --> 00:20:00 because I have... My copy. Yes, you got a pre
00:20:00 --> 00:20:04 -release version, early. Yes, feel special. You
00:20:04 --> 00:20:08 are, you are. Thank you for that. But you start
00:20:08 --> 00:20:12 the book with, the windowsill was my refrigerator.
00:20:12 --> 00:20:16 Yes. Can you take us back to that moment and
00:20:16 --> 00:20:18 how it has shaped the leader you've become? Yeah,
00:20:18 --> 00:20:21 so the windowsill was my refrigerator. People
00:20:21 --> 00:20:24 always say, what does that mean? Yes. Because
00:20:24 --> 00:20:27 when I am introduced, there's always this bio,
00:20:27 --> 00:20:30 and the bio talks about SVP of investor relations,
00:20:31 --> 00:20:36 Wharton grad, Emory grad, Emory professor, so
00:20:36 --> 00:20:39 many things, managing $130 billion in stock market
00:20:39 --> 00:20:43 cap, managing $4 trillion in assets, right? Being
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46 in the boardroom with the Howard Schultz and
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 the Melody Hobson, and there's all this greatness.
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51 But I always like to remind people behind that
00:20:51 --> 00:20:55 I'm also a ninth grade dropout. I had my first
00:20:55 --> 00:20:59 son at the age of 14, and I was homeless. And
00:20:59 --> 00:21:01 so it's that moment of how does someone with
00:21:01 --> 00:21:07 a bio, like folks just heard, come from someone
00:21:07 --> 00:21:11 that had this backstory? And it's the power of
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14 owning your narrative. And I have found that
00:21:14 --> 00:21:16 owning my narrative and showing up being authentic
00:21:16 --> 00:21:20 has allowed my team to then be able to show up,
00:21:20 --> 00:21:24 feel lighter, then gravitate to me. then go the
00:21:24 --> 00:21:28 extra mile to the edge of the cliff when I need
00:21:28 --> 00:21:32 them to, and sometimes not even when I ask. And
00:21:32 --> 00:21:34 so the windowsill was my refrigerator is because
00:21:34 --> 00:21:38 being homeless, I had to put my son's milk on
00:21:38 --> 00:21:42 a windowsill to keep it cold. And that's the
00:21:42 --> 00:21:44 essence of the windowsill was my refrigerator.
00:21:45 --> 00:21:51 And going from that to first step. Going back
00:21:51 --> 00:21:53 to school. So you're a ninth grade dropout. Yes.
00:21:54 --> 00:21:57 You somehow get back to school and you go to
00:21:57 --> 00:22:00 a big four. Whatever you see. Can you talk a
00:22:00 --> 00:22:03 little bit about what carried you through just
00:22:03 --> 00:22:05 that gap? Because it's huge. Because I'm on the
00:22:05 --> 00:22:07 board of a not -for -profit called Hope, and
00:22:07 --> 00:22:10 we help single parents. Oh, I got to get involved
00:22:10 --> 00:22:13 with that. Oh, yeah. Complete an education degree.
00:22:13 --> 00:22:16 And what we found is a lot of people give up
00:22:16 --> 00:22:21 education because parenthood is so hard. And
00:22:21 --> 00:22:23 it's hard to find a job when you don't have the
00:22:23 --> 00:22:26 degree or the support of your family. to just
00:22:26 --> 00:22:29 say, I'm just going to go even part -time. It's
00:22:29 --> 00:22:32 so hard. So I'm curious to hear how you manage
00:22:32 --> 00:22:37 just that gap. Yeah. So for me, it was having
00:22:37 --> 00:22:40 this, what I would call, quote -unquote, all
00:22:40 --> 00:22:44 -American upbringing. My father was military.
00:22:44 --> 00:22:46 He was an engineer. My mother was all about community
00:22:46 --> 00:22:49 service. So I saw what, in essence, greatness
00:22:49 --> 00:22:52 was supposed to look like. And so when that chapter
00:22:52 --> 00:22:55 of my life changed, I still had that in my mind.
00:22:56 --> 00:23:00 I still knew what I was capable of being. I still
00:23:00 --> 00:23:03 knew the life I was capable of having. And so
00:23:03 --> 00:23:05 it really took a lot of grit and resilience to
00:23:05 --> 00:23:07 get through that chapter. And eventually I went
00:23:07 --> 00:23:09 to an alternative high school where I took my
00:23:09 --> 00:23:12 son with me every day to school. And he's in
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 one room and there's a glass wall. And I'm sitting
00:23:15 --> 00:23:18 in the other room with other teen moms or other
00:23:18 --> 00:23:21 individuals that have had behavior issues at
00:23:21 --> 00:23:23 their traditional high school. And now they're
00:23:23 --> 00:23:27 there. But it was a way to then eventually get
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 back into the academic space. But there was a
00:23:29 --> 00:23:31 gap between being a ninth grade dropout and getting
00:23:31 --> 00:23:35 to that alternative school. And I do think so
00:23:35 --> 00:23:38 often people will put schooling on the back burner.
00:23:39 --> 00:23:42 I talk about in the book how a parent should
00:23:42 --> 00:23:45 never have to make. tough decisions. And the
00:23:45 --> 00:23:47 book is all about my journey, but how it equates
00:23:47 --> 00:23:50 to leadership and helping others be better leaders.
00:23:50 --> 00:23:53 And I talked about one particular example, when
00:23:53 --> 00:23:55 my son was sick with a fever, so he couldn't
00:23:55 --> 00:23:58 go to daycare. And at this point, I'm in college.
00:23:58 --> 00:24:02 And so I had to have my sixth son sleep in the
00:24:02 --> 00:24:06 break room of a neighborhood pizza shop, just
00:24:06 --> 00:24:09 so I can go to class and take a calculus exam
00:24:09 --> 00:24:13 that was required. Right? But normally people
00:24:13 --> 00:24:16 would say, You can't go to daycare. I don't have
00:24:16 --> 00:24:18 any family. I'm just going to miss the exam.
00:24:18 --> 00:24:20 But then you're putting your grades in jeopardy,
00:24:20 --> 00:24:22 graduation in jeopardy. But there's so many things
00:24:22 --> 00:24:24 like that. And then I talk about how that translates
00:24:24 --> 00:24:27 to leaders and how so often as leaders, especially
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 in the C -suite, but even middle management,
00:24:29 --> 00:24:31 even when you're starting out, you're going to
00:24:31 --> 00:24:34 have to make tough decisions and decisions that
00:24:34 --> 00:24:37 no one will ever understand. But sometimes you're
00:24:37 --> 00:24:39 making a decision because your only options is
00:24:39 --> 00:24:42 choosing between hard and harder. And as you
00:24:42 --> 00:24:44 grow to be a leader, you have to be comfortable
00:24:44 --> 00:24:47 with making decisions between hard and harder.
00:24:47 --> 00:24:51 Your story is so amazing. And you sharing it
00:24:51 --> 00:24:56 so freely is mind -boggling for me. And I'm curious
00:24:56 --> 00:24:59 to hear, at what point did you realize that your
00:24:59 --> 00:25:02 struggles were not to be something you will hide,
00:25:02 --> 00:25:06 but something you could lead from? So for me,
00:25:06 --> 00:25:08 reigning as Miss Georgia, my platform was actually
00:25:08 --> 00:25:12 inspiring and motivating at -risk youth. Because
00:25:12 --> 00:25:16 I am one. And so I always had this freedom to
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19 share my journey and share my story. I think
00:25:19 --> 00:25:21 the difference was there wasn't all this social
00:25:21 --> 00:25:25 media. And so in a way, it almost was like my
00:25:25 --> 00:25:28 life was siloed. I had all this community effort,
00:25:28 --> 00:25:31 all this community engagement. I was out kind
00:25:31 --> 00:25:33 of trying to make a difference, fulfilling that
00:25:33 --> 00:25:35 purpose, pouring from my heart. And then I had
00:25:35 --> 00:25:37 the corporate America side, not intentionally
00:25:37 --> 00:25:39 keeping them separate. It was just a different
00:25:39 --> 00:25:43 way in how we operate it. And so now I'm just
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 making sure that people understand now that the
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 the worlds have integrated and everything's on
00:25:48 --> 00:25:51 social media, how this actually has made me a
00:25:51 --> 00:25:54 better leader. Right. So often people will say,
00:25:54 --> 00:25:57 oh, my goodness, you have high engagement scores.
00:25:58 --> 00:25:59 You have people that want to follow you from
00:25:59 --> 00:26:02 department to department. Yes. That didn't come
00:26:02 --> 00:26:04 natural. It's not something you learn in a book.
00:26:04 --> 00:26:09 No, no, no. And so just sharing. My story so
00:26:09 --> 00:26:13 people can understand that sometimes the same
00:26:13 --> 00:26:15 scars that you're suppressing are the scars that
00:26:15 --> 00:26:17 are actually giving you your superpower, but
00:26:17 --> 00:26:19 you're not letting them blossom and you're not
00:26:19 --> 00:26:21 showcasing them. And so I'm just trying to give
00:26:21 --> 00:26:25 others the comfort to know that you can showcase
00:26:25 --> 00:26:27 it and it can still be your competitive advantage
00:26:27 --> 00:26:30 versus being the thing that holds you back. That
00:26:30 --> 00:26:33 is so hard, though, because for someone listening
00:26:33 --> 00:26:38 now, even myself. You can feel stuck by your
00:26:38 --> 00:26:42 past or like how your past is defining you. So
00:26:42 --> 00:26:45 what could be like a first step that someone
00:26:45 --> 00:26:48 listening could take to be okay with sharing
00:26:48 --> 00:26:51 their struggles, with being okay with leading
00:26:51 --> 00:26:55 from that place? Well, the one thing is, and
00:26:55 --> 00:26:57 you just said it, right? You could be so stuck
00:26:57 --> 00:26:59 with how people define you. That in essence is
00:26:59 --> 00:27:03 the power of owning your narrative. It is not
00:27:03 --> 00:27:05 up to anyone else to own your narrative but you.
00:27:06 --> 00:27:09 It is not up to anyone else to own your narrative
00:27:09 --> 00:27:11 but you. Just like it's not up to anyone else
00:27:11 --> 00:27:14 to shape your leadership style but you. And so
00:27:14 --> 00:27:17 that is also when I thought about this book and
00:27:17 --> 00:27:20 crafting it, I did not want it to be just a monologue.
00:27:20 --> 00:27:23 I did not want someone just to read my journey.
00:27:23 --> 00:27:25 And so I have in the book, it's like 30 -some
00:27:25 --> 00:27:29 pages at the end, where it then turns this monologue
00:27:29 --> 00:27:32 into giving people direction on how do they reflect
00:27:32 --> 00:27:35 on their journey. And it's prompts and leadership
00:27:35 --> 00:27:39 kind of what I would say triggers to think about
00:27:39 --> 00:27:43 on how are you showing up as a leader and things
00:27:43 --> 00:27:45 to make people think through some of their journey
00:27:45 --> 00:27:48 and how that then equates to being a leader.
00:27:48 --> 00:27:50 And so I wanted that in there because I didn't
00:27:50 --> 00:27:53 want the book to be a monologue. I really wanted
00:27:53 --> 00:27:56 it to be a leadership tool that people can read
00:27:56 --> 00:27:58 and they can utilize and they can then say, you
00:27:58 --> 00:28:01 know what, this is something as a team. We need
00:28:01 --> 00:28:03 to all center around, and let's go through this
00:28:03 --> 00:28:06 as a workshop. We need to talk about this in
00:28:06 --> 00:28:08 our next team meeting. And I think that's what
00:28:08 --> 00:28:10 we're missing all too often, especially with
00:28:10 --> 00:28:14 social media. It's this whole image that perfection
00:28:14 --> 00:28:18 wins. Oh, gosh. Yes. And I feel like perfection
00:28:18 --> 00:28:25 is an illusion. It is. And I feel like perfection
00:28:25 --> 00:28:31 will divide. Authenticity will connect. And all
00:28:31 --> 00:28:34 too often, we're not reminded of that. And so
00:28:34 --> 00:28:37 I'm hoping that this book reminds not only people
00:28:37 --> 00:28:40 individually to kind of embrace their own journey,
00:28:40 --> 00:28:42 but to think about how that shows up in your
00:28:42 --> 00:28:44 leadership style and to think about how do you
00:28:44 --> 00:28:47 become a better leader because of it. Yes, because
00:28:47 --> 00:28:50 I had another podcast interview with Cindy Wilson.
00:28:50 --> 00:28:53 She was talking about how you can't just switch
00:28:53 --> 00:28:56 off and be a leader and be a person. The two
00:28:56 --> 00:28:59 always be together. Yes. Because you can't just
00:28:59 --> 00:29:01 switch off work and now it's life and then you
00:29:01 --> 00:29:05 switch back. You carry baggage from one to the
00:29:05 --> 00:29:08 other and from the other to one. So that really
00:29:08 --> 00:29:12 resonates with me. Yeah. And I talked about this
00:29:12 --> 00:29:14 in the book. And sometimes it was going through
00:29:14 --> 00:29:16 the book and recalling my stories that I forgot
00:29:16 --> 00:29:19 about myself. Right. But in the book, I talk
00:29:19 --> 00:29:22 about how being in corporate America, someone
00:29:22 --> 00:29:25 was looking at a pizza box. And as they looked
00:29:25 --> 00:29:27 at the pizza box, they had said, who keeps doing
00:29:27 --> 00:29:30 this to the pizza? And what they were looking
00:29:30 --> 00:29:35 at was the pizza being cut, the pizza being left,
00:29:35 --> 00:29:37 but the crust being gone off of multiple pieces
00:29:37 --> 00:29:41 of pizza. And it was in that moment that I realized
00:29:41 --> 00:29:44 that my childhood trauma, drama, and journey
00:29:44 --> 00:29:48 followed me into the corporate space. Because
00:29:48 --> 00:29:50 when I was homeless and I could only afford a
00:29:50 --> 00:29:53 dollar piece of pizza, it was $1 .25, I would
00:29:53 --> 00:29:56 give it to my son as a toddler. I would let him
00:29:56 --> 00:29:59 eat the pizza. And as a kid, they always leave
00:29:59 --> 00:30:02 behind the crust. And the crust was my dinner.
00:30:03 --> 00:30:08 And so here I was now in corporate America. I
00:30:08 --> 00:30:12 got my legs underneath me. I'm quote unquote
00:30:12 --> 00:30:16 doing well. And I'm in a corporate space still
00:30:16 --> 00:30:23 unconsciously and subconsciously in that childhood
00:30:23 --> 00:30:26 journey of cutting the crust off and only eating
00:30:26 --> 00:30:29 the crust, even though I'm sitting with other
00:30:29 --> 00:30:34 people in suits in corporate America. It was
00:30:34 --> 00:30:38 an example of just if you don't address it, it's
00:30:38 --> 00:30:39 going to follow you and it's going to show up
00:30:39 --> 00:30:43 in ways that you never expect. Oh, yes. That
00:30:43 --> 00:30:48 is so true. As you were talking, so many memories
00:30:48 --> 00:30:52 came back of how I came as an immigrant here
00:30:52 --> 00:30:55 in the U .S. and some of the habits I took as
00:30:55 --> 00:30:58 a broke college student to make. Things work.
00:30:58 --> 00:31:01 And even as now, you can afford the full pizza.
00:31:02 --> 00:31:05 You can buy pizza for the whole floor. It's the
00:31:05 --> 00:31:09 same thing. It shows up in different ways. But
00:31:09 --> 00:31:13 how do you actually get comfortable leaving that
00:31:13 --> 00:31:17 mindset or is it a continuous journey to let
00:31:17 --> 00:31:19 behind the trauma? Because I don't think one
00:31:19 --> 00:31:22 therapy session is what will resolve it, for
00:31:22 --> 00:31:26 example. How are you able to grow out of it?
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29 Yeah, so part of it is you have to acknowledge
00:31:29 --> 00:31:31 it, right? And that's the whole essence of owning
00:31:31 --> 00:31:34 your narrative. So often we're suppressing it.
00:31:34 --> 00:31:36 True. And if you suppress it, you're not acknowledging.
00:31:37 --> 00:31:41 And so I always say I cannot acknowledge, I cannot
00:31:41 --> 00:31:43 celebrate my success without acknowledging my
00:31:43 --> 00:31:47 scars. And so being able to acknowledge it, then
00:31:47 --> 00:31:51 it starts to resolve itself. But all too often
00:31:51 --> 00:31:55 we have this image of perfection. Yes. And that's
00:31:55 --> 00:31:58 really... holding us back from being probably
00:31:58 --> 00:32:00 the greatest that we can be not only as a person
00:32:00 --> 00:32:03 but as a leader yes because suppressing feels
00:32:03 --> 00:32:07 good right because you don't temporarily temporarily
00:32:07 --> 00:32:10 it feels good yeah temporarily right eventually
00:32:10 --> 00:32:13 and then from even the cfo perspective right
00:32:13 --> 00:32:16 these are individuals your listeners they are
00:32:16 --> 00:32:20 in charge of a whole function a whole function
00:32:21 --> 00:32:23 And so just think about how much weight people
00:32:23 --> 00:32:25 are carrying across all those different functions.
00:32:26 --> 00:32:28 And just think if you could show up and be just
00:32:28 --> 00:32:31 a little more authentic. And sometimes it's not
00:32:31 --> 00:32:33 necessarily bringing all of yourself to work
00:32:33 --> 00:32:35 if that's what you choose not to do. But if you
00:32:35 --> 00:32:38 can just think about it, you then by default
00:32:38 --> 00:32:41 become a little more empathetic for others, even
00:32:41 --> 00:32:44 if you don't share all of you. You can start
00:32:44 --> 00:32:47 somewhere. And then in essence, that's where
00:32:47 --> 00:32:49 the contribution rises. That's where the team
00:32:49 --> 00:32:52 dynamics become more positive. That's where the
00:32:52 --> 00:32:56 team bonding becomes stronger. That's when you
00:32:56 --> 00:32:59 get the team to truly deliver on what you're
00:32:59 --> 00:33:02 trying to do as a company. It all starts, though,
00:33:02 --> 00:33:08 with the person. Yeah. Wow. I think you already
00:33:08 --> 00:33:10 answered this question, but I still want to ask.
00:33:10 --> 00:33:14 So who is this book for and who do you think
00:33:14 --> 00:33:17 needs it the most right now? Yeah. I mean, this
00:33:17 --> 00:33:21 book is for leaders. It's for people that are
00:33:21 --> 00:33:23 even individual contributors because this book
00:33:23 --> 00:33:27 has multifaceted to it. One, it's all about my
00:33:27 --> 00:33:29 journey. So for those who are just like, how
00:33:29 --> 00:33:32 did she do this? And I can relate. Let me read
00:33:32 --> 00:33:35 it. It's for them. But it's also for individuals
00:33:35 --> 00:33:37 that are in leadership roles who need to understand
00:33:37 --> 00:33:40 how lifting the weight off of others will help
00:33:40 --> 00:33:42 you not only be a better leader, but it'll help
00:33:42 --> 00:33:45 you get more out of your team. And then in terms
00:33:45 --> 00:33:48 of just, you know, who does it benefit? I mean,
00:33:48 --> 00:33:51 I think right now we're in this era where everything
00:33:51 --> 00:33:55 is about perfection in terms of an image. Everything's
00:33:55 --> 00:33:58 about perfection. And so just being able to speak
00:33:58 --> 00:34:01 with people and hearing. that it's the raw story
00:34:01 --> 00:34:04 that resonates more than what's on my resume,
00:34:04 --> 00:34:07 there's so much benefit on why people need to
00:34:07 --> 00:34:10 just sit down and just have the courage by hopefully
00:34:10 --> 00:34:12 reading this, they'll get some of that. Oh yeah,
00:34:12 --> 00:34:14 I'm already getting some of that just listening
00:34:14 --> 00:34:18 to you. So yeah, so how can people get the book
00:34:18 --> 00:34:20 and how can they support you on this journey?
00:34:20 --> 00:34:24 Yes, so the book is available on Amazon. So feel
00:34:24 --> 00:34:27 free to go to Amazon and... The book cover looks
00:34:27 --> 00:34:29 like this. It's Own Your Narrative by Tiffany
00:34:29 --> 00:34:34 Willis. But then also they can follow me at underscore
00:34:34 --> 00:34:36 Tiffany Willis on Instagram. I'm also really
00:34:36 --> 00:34:40 big on just posting leadership lessons on LinkedIn.
00:34:40 --> 00:34:43 So please, if you're not on LinkedIn on my page,
00:34:43 --> 00:34:45 please feel free to join me on LinkedIn. And
00:34:45 --> 00:34:49 also if, you know, your readers, your listeners
00:34:49 --> 00:34:51 are out there and they're in roles and they're
00:34:51 --> 00:34:53 thinking of, hey, we need a lunch and learn for
00:34:53 --> 00:34:56 a team or we need a leadership summit. Please,
00:34:56 --> 00:34:58 I would be more than happy to join you all. And
00:34:58 --> 00:35:02 you can find all my information at tiffany -willis
00:35:02 --> 00:35:04 .com and would love to participate in that way
00:35:04 --> 00:35:07 as well. Oh, yes. I'm so signing you up. Thank
00:35:07 --> 00:35:10 you. Thank you so much. You're so welcome. Thank
00:35:10 --> 00:35:13 you for having me. It's an honor and great job
00:35:13 --> 00:35:16 on doing what you're doing. I'm watching you
00:35:16 --> 00:35:19 from the sidelines and cheering you on. So kudos.
00:35:19 --> 00:35:21 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank
00:35:21 --> 00:35:24 you. And that's it for today's episode of the
00:35:24 --> 00:35:26 diary of a CFO podcast live in Atlanta. You can
00:35:26 --> 00:35:30 feel the difference and I'm loving this in person
00:35:30 --> 00:35:33 style and getting to really understand the human
00:35:33 --> 00:35:36 beings behind the big titles. So if you felt
00:35:36 --> 00:35:38 the same way, don't forget to get Tiffany's book
00:35:38 --> 00:35:42 and also follower. I will definitely drop all
00:35:42 --> 00:35:45 the links in the show notes. You have to do this
00:35:45 --> 00:35:46 because I'm trying to be like her when I grew
00:35:46 --> 00:35:49 up. Okay. So I'll see you in the next one.